A hole in the ground at Knott Mill

Now there is no disguising that this is a hole in the ground.

At which point that 1962 song by Bernard Cribbins* springs to mind or the equally funny but savage music hall classic “They're moving father's grave to build a sewer”**

But as holes go this one is interesting and no doubt when finished the building which fills the hole will excite even more controversy than the Beethan Tower because it will be another of those monster structures which will dominate not only the city but also be seen from way outside Manchester.

All of which just leaves me to promise that as construction begins Andy will be back to record its story, from the first day the ground is broken to the time sometime in the future when its glass and steel sides glisten in
the Manchester sun.

All of which just leaves a retrospect story on what was once there.

Location; Knott Mill

Pictures; construction underway, 2016 Knott Mill from the collection of Andy Robertson

*Bernard Cribbins,  Hole In The Ground, 1962

**"They're moving father's grave to build a sewer
They're moving it regardless of expense.
They're moving his remains to lay down nine-inch drains
To irrigate some rich bloke's residence.

Now what's the use of having a religion?
If when you're dead you cannot get some peace
'Cause some society chap wants a pipeline to his tank
And moves you from your place of rest and peace...

Now father in his life was not a quitter
And I'm sure that he'll not be a quitter now.
And in his winding sheet, he will haunt that privy seat
And only let them go when he'll allow.

Now won't there be some bleedin' consternation,
And won't those city toffs begin to rave!
But it's no more than they deserve, 'cause they had the bleedin' nerve
To muck about a British workman's grave."

Didsbury Pubs .............. stories, paintings and a bit more ........ nu 1 the Crown

A short series reflecting on some of the Didsbury pubs Peter has painted and I have spent time in.

I have to confess it will be a long series given that both of us over the years can claim to have been in all of them, although never I hasten to add been thrown out.

This is the Crown Inn.

The Crown has not always occupied the entire block from York Street down to the new build.

Back in 1911 it was just the central property comprising eight rooms and was run by the 49 year old Albert Eggleton who was a widow.

Next to him at number 118 were John and Kate Booth who described themselves as shop keepers of mixed business while on the other side at 122 Mr Bourne, the tailor had left sometimes between the December of 1910 and the April of 1911.

At eight rooms the Crown was far larger than number 118 which had just four rooms or number 126 with its 3 rooms.

And that just leaves me to quote Andy who told me "I remember going there in early/mid seventies.

On Sunday lunchtime there used to be an informal folk session and Harry Boardman that famous Lancashire dialect singer would often turn up.

There was an old silver haired waiter called Billy dressed in a smart white coat. 

You pressed the bell behind you and up he would pop and take your order thus saving valuable drinking time which was valuable as pubs only opened 12-2 those days."

So there you have it, a little bit of pub history which just leaves me to do the outrageous plus....... you find

Peter’s painting is in our book Didsbury Through Time, available at Morton’s Bookshop, and at the this very moment we are working on Manchester Pubs, The stories behind the Doors.

Location; Didsbury

Painting; Crown Inn  © 2014 Peter Topping, Paintings from Pictures, Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

St Werburgh’s Church

An occasional series looking at our churches.

Now I have spent a lot of time over the years writing about St Clement's, particularly the old church on the green and rarely look at the rest.*

So when Andy Robertson sent over this image it was time to broaden my horizons and remind people of the work done by Tony Goulding on the church.**

In recognition of the growth of Chorlton in 1898 a new parish was established consisting of part of St Clements’s parish and some others.

The foundation stone of St Werburgh's Church was laid on November 5 1899, and its chancel and transepts dedicated in 1900.

The church was completed and opened on June 1 1902 and consecrated July 15 1902.***

Location; St Werburgh’s Church Wilbraham Road

Picture; St Werburgh’s Church, 2016 from the collection of Andy Robertson

*St Clement's Church, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/St%20Clement%27s%20Church

**St Werburgh’s Church, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/St%20Werburgh%27s%20Church

***St Werbugh’s Church, http://www.stwerburghcch.co.uk/

Watching "Pomona Land" change

Now I could go on at length about  how the area has changed in just a few decades but rather think that is pretty obvious.  

And of course that changes is continuing, all of which makes Andy Robertson’s new series of pictures a welcome addition to the bog.

Back in May he wandered down to “Pomona Land” and recorded the landscape along the ship Canal.

The only question is what will have gone up on the open land opposite the flats next time Andy is down there.

Pictures; Pomona Land, May 2015, from the collection of Andy Robertson

My house on Well Hall Road and two more, thank you Chrissie

Another in the series which feature contemporary photographs of places with a history.

This was where we lived from 1964 till 1991.

Back then the front door was painted blue and there was a front porch which was only built after dad had submitted plans to the Progress Estate.

The walls were yet to be painted white and the bins were kept at the back.

My bedroom was the one at the from above the door.

There was still a brick wall separating the wide expanse of green from the street to our front door and the very tall and impressive tree still dominated the spot

And Mrs Gold lived next to us in the end house to your left.

All of which is perhaps a tad too personnel so instead I shall include two more pictures of the Well Hall estate for no other reason than I lived there and they were taken by new friend Chrissie and I like them.

Looking at them again they bring back fond memories.

Of course that odd well worn thought "that you don't miss the place till you've gone" is pretty much how I feel when I see these scenes of Well Hall.

But there will be lots of new people who will be enjoying the place and its history so that is consolation enough.


Pictures; of the Progress Estate, Chrissie Rose, February 2014

An ongoing project to honour those who fought in the Great War ...........by Martin Logan

WW1 100 ANNIVERSARY MCT EMPLOYEES

Brass memorial plaque

My name is Martin Logan and I worked on Manchester Buses from 1977 until retirement in 2014, 34 years at Princess Road Bus Depot, then 3 years at Sharston Bus Depot until March 2014.

I was always conscious of the Memorial Plaque on the outer wall of Princess Road Bus Depot. However as time went on I started to look more closely at it and I then began to wonder who were they, these men whose names were inscribed on this piece of bronze

Since 2008 I have made contact with the relatives of Herbert Berry, George Leonard Collins and William Starkey who died on the 1st July 1916.

To date I have found info on 295 of the 310  names inscribed on the Memorial Plaque. In researching I have found many errors in spelling of names and incorrect Service Numbers / Regiment. This could be the reason why I am having difficulty in accessing information on the remaining 15 names.

James Gilmour, Charlotte Starkey and Martin Logan*

Can U help

Heald W – Guard – Rifleman - 8th Battalion Rifle Brigade
Jones B – Car Cleaner – Royal Naval Division
Lamb G (George) – Labourer – 21st Battalion Manchester
Locklin J - Car Cleaner – Private – National Reserve
Mangnall T (Thomas) – Car Cleaner –6th Batt Loyal Nth Lancashire
McCullough E (Edward) – Driver – Royal Garrison Artillery
McNamara A – Driver – 160837 Gunner – Royal Field Artillery
Partington E – Trolley Boy – 53rd Y.S. Battalion Liverpool
Robinson J – Platelayer – 3/8 Battalion Manchester
Robinson JH – Clerk – Kings Own Royal Lancaster
Smith Arthur – Linesman – Royal Engineers
Smith Harold John – Guard – 23rd Battalion Royal Fusiliers
Smith Wm – Clerk – 6th Battalion Manchester
Taylor W – Trolley Boy – Manchester
Wolstenhulme R – Despatcher – 51st Training Reserve Battalion

Please contact me martin.logan@btinternet.com / 07985490124

Martin Logan © July 2016

Pictures; brass memorial plaque, and  from Manchester Cathedral Friday 1st July 2016.
Left is James Gilmour, relative of Herbert Berry. Centre is Charlotte Starkey, relative of William Starkey who died on the 1st July 1916 and Martin Logan from the collection of Martin Logan

Discovering our great uncle Roger did end up in British Columbia

Now here is a lesson on always believing the family stories and by extension reading the records.

Extract from his army records, 1919

Our great uncle Roger was migrated by Middlemore in 1914 on behalf of the Derby Guardians, worked on
three farms in NS and NB and ran away to enlist in the Canadian Expeditionary Force in 1915.

He did his time on the Western Front and was demobbed in January 1919 in St John NB.

So far so good.  I knew that he had settled in BC.

Revelstoke railway station, 1915

But British Columbia is a big place and despite a few leads it and a bit of leg work it all proved a damp squid.

And here comes that simple observation.............. always go back to the records and look again and again.

Which is what our Marisa did and she turned up the intriguing address of the B&B Department, Canadian Pacific Railway, Revelstoke, British Columbia.

Now I have no idea what a B&B Department was, or where in Revel stoke he worked.  But that as they say is just a matter of time.

If we are lucky the employee’s records may still exist or better still like some of the British railway companies will have been posted online.

MacKenzie Avenue, Revelstoke, 2003

There may also be municipal records relating to his stay in the town and who knows just possibly someone who has a connection to a James Rogers whose given name was Roger Hall, and whose birth address was Birmingham despite his stated one of Derby.

All of very intriguing and of course very promising leading me yet again to say always believe the family stories however unbelievable and check those records.

Location; Revelstoke, British Columbia

Picture; detail of the army records of James Rogers, courtesy of the Library and Archive Canada, Library and Archives Canada, http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discover/military-heritage/first-world-war/first-world-war-1914-1918-cef/Pages/item.aspx?IdNumber=317382  Railway station in Revelstoke, British Columbia, Canada - 1915 from  Mississippi Department of Archives and History, Milton McFarland in the Public Domain and MacKenzie Avenue, Revelstoke,2003, Author waferboard, this file is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution 2.0 Generic license.