The not so different bits of where we live, part 2 ............. Greenwich

Now I am always intrigued at those more recent photographs of where we live.

So while pictures from the late 19th and early 20th centuries are fascinating often everything is so different that it is almost looking at a different landscape.

But those from say the 1960s onwards are often almost the same but not quite, and with this in mind here over the next few days are some from the camera of Jean Gammons all taken in the late 1970s.

And that is all I shall say,

Picture; looking down Greenwich, 1977 from the collection of Jean Gammons

Adventures out of Peckham ........ the park, General Wolf and a song by Mr Como

The sun is shining and while it might not yet be hot enough to crack the paving stones, there is a promise of a fine day ahead of us.

Greenwich Park, 2017

And on days like this when you are ten, adventures just happen.

We had met up mid way between all our houses and immediately fell out about what to do.

None of us had much in the way of money so Red Rovers which offered unlimited travel across London for 2/6d was not going to happen and it became a matter of where we hadn’t been and how far it would take to get there.

All of us agreed that whatever we did it had to be out of Peckham and so for the second time in a week we headed off to Greenwich Park.

River, 2017

This was not entirely such a good idea as all three of us had been in the dog house for our last adventure which had involved us exploring the beach by the foot tunnel.

We could have chosen that sandy strip in front of the Naval College but instead opted for a spot down river by three beached barges, and that led to disaster as each of us sank up to our ankles in oozy, oily Thames mud.

That was terrifying enough, but having been rescued by a bargee who pulled all of us free, there was the long walk home caked in that mud and a series of almost identical interrogations about what had happened. To my eternal shame I blamed John and Jimmy.

But undaunted by such an ordeal we went back, although this time we kept to the park.

That long walk, 2017

Once through the gates, and having made the long walk past the water fountain to General Wolf, and faced with that steep slope we rolled down it.

Now that was fun but daft, given that the grass was newly cut and stuck to us, and then took ages to fall off while we played amongst the trees and explored the courtyard of the Royal Observatory.

Then, as the sun climbed higher in the sky we sat on the bench by General Wolf and like him we gazed out across park and the river to that other place, north of the water.

From General Wolf, 1978

Back then the river was still a working river and the tall blocks of flats and offices had yet to be built leaving a vague memory that we could see the Monument but sixty years separate me from that adventure and I dare say I have got that bit wrong.

But never underestimate the power of a sunny day and cut grass to throw you back into your childhood.  Or the delights of warm lemonade from a glass bottle that we shared.

We were the master of all we surveyed and to the bafflement of passersby recited a rhyme which contrived to name all the TV Westerns in a story.  I can no longer remember the details suffice to say,  that Rawhide, Bonanza, Laramie, Cheyanne and perhaps Have Gun Will Travel were all featured.

Looking up towards General Wolf

I guess it was inspired by the 1959 Perry Como song, Delaware, which had lines like, “What did Del-a-ware boy, what did Delaware, She wore a brand New Jersey”, going on to mention another 13 US States.

The challenge of both Mr Como’s song and our rhyme was to remember each line perfectly, a task I failed to do then and still can’t today.

Perhaps out there someone will remember the TV rhyme and offer it to me.

We shall see.

Location; Peckham and Greenwich

Pictures; Greenwich Park and the River, 2017 from the collection of Jillian Goldsmith, and looking out from General Wolf, and looking up to him, 1978 from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Ballast Quay and a word of advice

Now just 40 years ago I wandered down Ballast Quay, on the off chance I would bump into someone I knew from the days I worked at Glenvilles, or one of my old drinking companions from the Cutty Sark.

Of course I never did and the failure made me a bit sad.

More so, because we had some good times sitting outside the pub on that low brick wall watching as the night drew on, interrupted only by the sound of the barges banging together from the swell left by a passing pleasure cruiser.

But a swift pint and I felt less sad.

Today I barely recognise the place.

True, the Harbour Master's House and a row of houses are still there along with the Cutty Sark but the big industrial warehouse on the corner of Pelton Road has gone as has the yard almost opposite the pub.

Perhaps a lesson in it being wise never to go back. 

And to get your facts right. I always thought that the Harbour Master's House was the Customs House until Garry Luttman put me straight leaving me quite rightly to correct the mistake.

So thanks Garry.

Location; Greenwich

Picture; Ballast Quay, 1979 from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Memories of that other Thames ……

 I don’t know if cargo ships still berth along my bit of the River at Greenwich.

But someone will know, and I hope will tell me.

I left London in 1969 and while I still came home for holidays my visits to this bit of where I grew up became less and less.

But back in the late 1970s I did wander the water with a camera and recorded what I saw.

To some they will be dismal, and grimy but they were my part of London.

What strikes me about the berthed ship is how deep the inside compared to the men.

It’s a silly observation given that the hold had to store heaps of things, but it reminds me of just how different the Thames at Greenwich was five decades ago.

The image is one that sat as a collection of negatives in our cellar for 40 odd years, and only recently has come out of the shadows as I digitalize those pictures.

And Peter from Greenwich added "Good evening Andrew, I always enjoy your pictures of the grimy industrial part of my hometown. 

The coaster on the mud at Lovells was one of the first of a type designed with elevating wheelhouses and masts ets to work upstream on the Rhine and other European rivers. The depth of the hold would have probably been around 4 metres".

Location; The River Thames

Pictures; waiting to load, the Thames, 1979, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

  

The lost pictures from home ...... no.24 a favourite pub

For four decades the pictures I took of Eltham and Woolwich in the mid ‘70’s sat undisturbed in our cellar.

But all good things eventually come to light.

They were colour slides which have been transferred electronically.

The quality of the original lighting and the sharpness is sometimes iffy, but they are a record of a lost Eltham and Woolwich.

Now I know this is Greenwich and not the other two places, but I was still living in Well Hall when we made this our local.

In the late 60s it was where we would go to sit on the wall and watch the Thames busy itself on warmer summer evenings, listening to the gentle thud as thebarges banged together on the swell.

Later it was where I would finish off the 6 till 2 shift at Glenville's the food factory, caked in dirty overalls covered in milk dust and yearning a pint.

And then I went back in the autumn of 1979.  The pub was still there and the power station and big crane, but my companions had scattered to different corners of London or like me far beyond.

I could have felt melancholy but that would have been daft.

Location; Greenwich

Picture; Greenwich, circa 1979, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Memories ….

It will be something like 46 years ago that I walked beside the River snapping away with a brand new camera.

I can't pretend the results were always what I wanted  and back then it was all smelly photography so the pictures I took during a brief trip home to Well Hall, had to wait until I returned to Manchester and processed them.

And the negatives have sat in the cellar for 4 decades.

But now they are out in the light of day, a reminder of what the River was like and that excursion out with the brand new camera.

Location; The River

Pictures, Walking the River, 1979 from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Arriving at Greenwich ……. long before now ….

It will be over 65 years ago that I first caught sight of the Queen’s House at Greenwich.

The Queens House, 1979

We had been on an adventure out of Peckham, walked all the way to Blackheath and then by degree through Greenwich Park to that point where General Wolf and the Royal Observatory stand facing down views of the River and beyond.

Nothing quite prepared me, John Cox or Jimmy O’Donnell for that view or for that matter the expanse of grass, bushes and trees which we had just encountered.

Arriving at Greenwich, 1979

Its nearest equivalent was Peckham Rye and the park and they paled into insignificance.

And once we had moved to Eltham in the spring of 1964 , both Blackheath and Greenwich Park along with that stretch of the River became my playground.

A decade and a bit later I took one of only two river trips from Westminster.  Both were made on a whim and an expensive and a long way of getting home from Central London via the River and Greenwich, which in turn wasted a return railway ticket.  But such are whims that make for memories.

Of course since then and since I took the pictures much has changed, and the view from the summit down to the River and beyond is dramatically different.

Location; Greenwich

Pictures; a lost Greenwich, 1979, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

The ship …….. a lighter …. and the River

Now I am the first to admit as pictures go these might not be the ones to enter for “The most exciting picture of the century”, but they are over 40 years old and come from a time when the Thames was still a working river.

I had wandered down to Greenwich looking for the old food factory where I had worked at the beginning of the 1970s.

It was called Glenvilles and was close the Tunnel, and along the way I decided to record whatever took my interest.

Just exactly where along the water I was I can’t now remember, but in the second image there are the silos of what I think were Tunnel Refineries, which after the passage of four decades  is as close as you will get to a location

Happily I am sure someone will correct me, citing the exact spot and adding heaps more detail.

Well we shall see.

And here is the reminder that we should all record the place, date and a bit of background information each time we go out with a camera.

Leaving me just to say that before anyone sneers at the quality of the images, they were taken when I was just beginning to develop and print my own photographs, using smelly photography and the negatives have sat in the cellar for 40 years.

Location; The River

Picture; The ship …….. a barge …. and the River, circa 1978/79 from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Adventures along the River ............

Not all adventures happen when you are ten.

It was the August of 1979 and I was home for a holiday and armed with a new camera I took myself off down by the river.

I was curious to see how things had changed from when I worked at a food factory hard by the tunnel.

Back then our favourite end of work routine was to walk into the Cutty Sark at lunchtime with our overalls stilled caked in milk powder and rub shoulders with the posh young things who had popped over the water to sample south east London pubs.

With hindsight I am the first to admit it was childish and irresponsible but when you are 19 you view things differently.

I can remember thinking that nothing much had changed in the decade I had been away.

The river was still a working river, warehouses still lined the water and during the day the place was filled by the noise of men at work.

And in the evening, sitting outside the Cutty Sark there was that occasional dull thud as the moored barges banged gently together on the swell caused by a late night pleasure boat.

I haven’t been back in thirty years but looking at pictures posted by friends of the same places, it seems the transformation is so dramatic and complete that I would feel lost.

At which point I have to stress, that this is no nostalgic rant at what we have lost.  The Thames could be a smelly and dangerous place, where those who worked it were often labouring for long hours, for low pay, and going home to substandard houses whose sell by date was well out.

But as a ten year old from Peckham soon to move to Eltham this was the backdrop to my life.

We never lived far from the river and despite its busy working existence we played on the mud when the tide was out, looking for treasure, but usually finding nothing more than sodden lumps of timber and the odd dead fish.

We took to the foot tunnels and travelled the ferry, explored that other place north of the River and on occasion just sat watching as ships, tugs and the odd upper class sailing boat passed us by.

Along with all of that, there was the smell, which was a mix of ozone, and ships fuel and rotting seaweed.

But being out of Peckham, you were also mindful that the stretch from Woolwich to Greenwich was not your stretch and there was every possibility that you would be challenged by other kids or told to “bugger off” by someone making his living from our playground.

And then I was eighteen and standing at the bus stop opposite the ferry, behind the cinema, waiting for a bus to work at six in the morning, idly watching the river, and catching the odd sharp gust of wind whipping off the water.

As adventures go it didn’t match those from my childhood or the ones I was to recreate in the ‘70s but there was still a bit of magic about it.

Location; the River across three decades

Pictures; walking the Thames, 1979, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Walking the River ......... by the Cutty Sark

A short series taken from one day when I walked along the River.

Back then the Thames was still a place to to earn a wage and watch as ships, and barges plied their way on the water.*

Location; the Thames

Picture; the River in 1979, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

*The lost Eltham, Greenwich, and Woolwich pictures, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/The%20lost%20Eltham%20and%20Woolwich%20pictures

The lost Eltham & Woolwich pictures ...... no. 31 .... back on the Thames at the Cutty Sark

It is not the best picture I have taken, added to which it has suffered a bit from being converted from old colour slide pictures but I like it.

And it is another of those images I took which reminds me of a Thames that has gone

For four decades it was one of the pictures I took of Eltham and Woolwich in the mid ‘70’s which sat undisturbed in our cellar.

But all good things eventually come to light.

They were colour slides which have been transferred electronically.

The quality of the original lighting and the sharpness is sometimes iffy, but they are a record of a lost Eltham and Woolwich.

Location; Greenwich

Picture; Greenwich circa 1976, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

The lost Eltham & Woolwich pictures ...... no. 32 ..... the river walk

Long before it became fashionable to walk beside the river from the modern apartment flat some of us were doing it as a regular part of our working day.

Depending on the shift I was on I often made that walk from the factory to the Cutty Sark Pub, in dirty milk stained overalls trying not to rub up against the rather posh customers.

For four decades it was one of the pictures I took of Eltham and Woolwich in the mid ‘70’s which sat undisturbed in our cellar.

But all good things eventually come to light.

They were colour slides which have been transferred electronically.

The quality of the original lighting and the sharpness is sometimes iffy, but they are a record of a lost Eltham and Woolwich.









Location; Greenwich





Picture; Greenwich circa 1976, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Walking the River ......... more men at work

A short series taken from one day when I walked along the River.

Back then the Thames was still a place to to earn a wage and watch  ships, and barges as they plied their way on the water.*

Location; the Thames




Picture; the River in 1979, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

*The lost Eltham and Woolwich pictures, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/The%20lost%20Eltham%20and%20Woolwich%20pictures

The view from the hill ……. and other pictures ….. by Phil Mackie

Now I have been revisiting some photographs taken by our Jill of Greenwich Park a few years back, and throwing in a few I took in the late 1970s.

And today I want to add a few by Phil Mackie who posted some of his to me and kindly agreed to them being shared.

Phil added of the classic view looking down towards the river, that this is “not technically a great shot but should serve as a comparison.

Have also thrown in one rather dark pic looking further upstream Both taken 15 June 1974.  

I have also included a few – should they be of use sometime – from the top of Calderwood Street car park in Woolwich, taken 6 July 1974”.

And as you do I leapt at the opportunity of going back to where I grew up.

Location; Greenwich and Woolwich

Pictures; Greenwich and Woolwich, 1974 from the collection of Phil Mackie

 

The lost Eltham & Woolwich pictures ...... no.28 General Wolf looks out

Now one of the first things you learn about taking pictures is to look for the sun before you snap away.

I didn't but the effect is all I wanted.

From  the pictures I took of Eltham and Woolwich in the mid ‘70’s which sat undisturbed in our cellar.

But all good things eventually come to light.

They were colour slides which have been transferred electronically.

The quality of the original lighting and the sharpness is sometimes iffy, but they are a record of a lost Eltham and Woolwich.

Location; Greenwich

Picture; Greenwich circa 1976, from the collection of Andrew Simpson