Wednesday, 31 December 2014

One hundred years of one house in Chorlton part 50 ............ greeting a New Year

December  in Chorlton
The continuing story of the house Joe and Mary Ann Scott lived in for over 50 years and the families that have lived here since.*

Now to be completely accurate we will not reach the centenary of the house until the middle of next year but we were close enough when I started these stories to make it almost that full century.

And nothing concentrates thoughts on that big anniversary than New Year’s Eve.

I have no idea how Joe and Mary Ann celebrated but it should not be too difficult to reconstruct given what I know of them and the way people welcomed in the New Year in the first half of the 20th century.

Of course the war years will have made the night a little different.

In 1915 when they moved in we were in the second year of the Great War and for the duration of the conflict I guess New Years Eve would have been a quiet affair tinged with the hope that the war could not last much longer.

A Happy New Year, 1921
By contrast those that they saw during the Second World War may have been even quieter given the shortages and the threat of air raids.

These may have lessened as the war drew to a close but never entirely went away and the memory of the Manchester Blitz was still a vivid one.

There had been fire bombs on the farm house directly opposite more at the top of Beech Road and in some of the surrounding streets along with a stick of high explosive bombs which fell across Barlow Moor and Claude Roads severely damaging the cinema and some houses.

Nor I suspect were the years directly following the end of the war any more elaborate.

There was still rationing which lingered on in to the 1950s compounded by fuel shortages and the scars left by the bombing.

All of which would have made it a very different evening to the one that John Mike and Lois enjoyed in the 1970s or the ones that have gone on in the years we have lived here.

Waiting for the New Year Eve 2009
Central to many of them was the trip to the pub which may either have involved seeing in the New Year with Stan and Moira in the Trevor or going on to a party.

Later on through the 80s into the 90s we stayed in with a couple of rented films for the kids, some champagne and a table full of food.

Now all in their way different but in other ways there was a continuity which binds all those decades together.

It starts with that simple observation that until relatively recently you didn’t have to buy a special ticket to get into a pub, fireworks were confined to a few short bursts of colour in the night sky and drifting across from the docks you could hear the sound of the ships sirens.

And last year there was one more break with tradition for while some of the lads spent the night in the house we had left for Varese to see the New Year in with Tina’s family.

Varese is an hour from Milan and the night was a big affair with a meal which went on for hours punctuated by games and welcoming in the New Year between courses.

Waiting for the New Year in Varese, 2013
We celebrated a full hour before Chorlton.

But this year we will be here and I rather think most of the lads will be if only before they go off into the night to see in the new year somewhere else leaving us to toast Jooles Holland and assorted guests in much the same way that Joe and Mary Ann accompanied Andy Stewart and the White Heather Club.

Pictures; New Year Greeting card, 1921, Tuck & Sons courtesy of  Tuck DB,,  from the collection of Andrew Simpson

*The story of house,

*The Story of one municipal flat in Varese,

Sunday, 28 December 2014

A little bit of history and a call for live music with the Smirks

I have been looking at my collection of old campaign badges.

Mine stretch back to the late 1960s and encompass many of the big issues of the period.  They are a wonderful introduction into the politics of the period ranging from CND, pensioners rights and plenty of industrial struggles.

Some are funny, a few very angry, a small number a little pretentious and the rest are wonderfully optimistic.

But behind them all were things that mattered to me at the time and most I still feel the same about nearly 40 years since I bought them.

Of course often the badges were a quick response to an immediate situation whether it was a factory closure a threat to a public service or a demand for a change in Government policy.

At other times they were about raising awareness which might be anything from “No to Nuclear Weapons”  “Manchester against Racism for Equality” or support for anti colonial movements.

Some did have more to do with wishful thinking but the majority were rooted in real things and upon the outcome turned the prosperity and hopes of whole communities.

This makes these humble little badges important because they are somebody’s history.

Put enough of them together from a particular period and you a have an insight into what was going on.

Of course they are only a start and the historian will dig much deeper than just the campaign badge but they are a pointer into the mood of how some people thought and acted.

And they were pretty much an instant response.  Two people with a badge machine and an imagination could respond to events passing them out in hours at a meeting or demonstration.

All of which leads me to Smirks against Travolta and the badge which I think my friend Lawrence gave me.

I was vaguely amused by it and really missed the point that there was a very real issue about the threat to live music from the growing popularity of discos and recorded music.

And as ever in going back to the Smirks I was led down a path to Jilted John whose demo record featured two of the Smirks.  From there by a slow process to Kirsty MacColl and There’s A Guy Who Works Down the Chip Shop which may be a long way from Dog Walkers Against the Bomb and the Peoples March For Jobs but it is fun.

Pictures; badges from the collection of Andrew Simpson

Saturday, 27 December 2014

Of night clubs and cinemas on Market Street in Staylbridge

Now I collect old cinemas and in my time have watched films in some of the oldest we have and stood outside many more which have long since gone dark.

But the Palace on Market Street in Stalybridge passed me by, or to be more accurate I passed it on many occasions when we lived in Ashton back in the 1970s but never went in.

To my shame when we went to the cinema it would have been in Manchester, where both of us worked by day and where we were drawn back to at the weekends.

Recently on one of those rare visits out to Stalybridge I clocked the place and was not surprised to see that it had closed and been converted into a night club.

That said it only shut up shop in 2003 which meant it survived longer than many picture houses, pretty much just missing it centenary.

It had opened in July 1913 as the Empire Picture Palace and seated 850 later becoming part of the H.D.Morehouse chain which operated it until the 1960s after which it was taken over by an independent operator closing finally in 2003.

And I seem to have missed its brief period as a night club which just leaves me to thank Peter for sending me his painting of the building.

At which stage I wish I could say it brought back happy memories which of course are not the case.

But I bet there will be many who remember magical nights at the Palace and perhaps even a few who will own up listening to their parents talking of their times at the old Empire.

If so I would like to hear them and include them in future stories of Stalybridge in the past.

After all Peter also painted quite a few of the other iconic buildings after a visit to Stalybridge in late November.

Painting; Rififi, once the Palace Cinema at Stalybridge,  © 2014 Peter Topping, Paintings from Pictures


*Cinema Treasures,

Wednesday, 24 December 2014

One hundred years of one house in Chorlton part 49 ............ no more advent calendars

The continuing story of the house Joe and Mary Ann Scott lived in for over 50 years and the families that have lived here since.*

Christmas 2014
Now in its long history none of those who have lived here before us ever faced the moment when buying the chocolate advent Calendars had become a thing of the past.

In the great sweep of history it may seem the most trivial of events but it marks a milestone in the story of this house.

Joe and Mary Ann never had children, John, Mike and Lois along with Mr and Mrs Hunter were really just passing through on to greater things and families elsewhere.

So it was only us who had children here and now have they all grown up and moved out.

Of course they will all still be here for Christmas for varying lengths of time but not from day one of opening the calendar.

Christmas 2014
Last year was the last when there was a row of them side by side on the bookshelf, each with their name carefully written at the top, because you can never be too careful even with a 23 year old that confusion will not cause them to eat someone else’s December 17.

And along with that has gone the hard decision of which product to go for from the bewildering choice.

That said it invariably ended up with four Cadbury’s and one Milky Bar.

But they have now gone the way of the Easter Eggs and the east egg hunts and mark a shift in the story of the house.

Still, pretty much all the other Christmas traditions have stayed the course.

Christmas 2012
The presents will still be put out on the night each in beside their own individual stockings which have been with them since birth and always in the same location around the front room.

And as they return with their partners these two have been added to the collection.

There will be the two Christmas trees indulgent I know but Adam’s in the precinct will do us a good deal as they have done for 30 years.

The big one will stand in the front room and the baby one in the dining room.

On the day, after the opening of the presents and before we eat there will be the traditional football match on the Rec, marked only by the fact that what once lasted an hour is more likely to be 30 minutes of gentle kick about.

This year we will have Simone and Rosa again who fly in from Milan on the 22nd and I am hoping that Ron Carol and Hayden will pop in.

Such are the traditions which all of us evolve over time.

Christmas 2013
Now I have no idea how Joe and Mary Ann celebrated Christmas but for Mike Lois and John it was a holiday of “two halves” with the actual day spent with families in Leeds and Weston.

Before the event and afterwards they would be back here and Christmas happened just a few days before the 25th with a big meal which included anyone who was around.

I was there for the Christmas of 1977 and back again when we had bought the house a few years later.

Christmas 2013
Which means I can account in one way or another for over a third of the history of the house reflecting that it wasn’t always advent calendars and I guess will not be again.

And that is the postscript because there was surprise and consternation that the advent calendars would be missing and so they have duly appeared in a row, although three of them were not touched till the 20th.

So the house continues to exert its traditions which is pretty much as it should be.

Pictures; Advent Calendars 2014, Christmas 1977 courtesy of Lois Elsden, and Christmas, 2012, 2013 from the collection of Andrew Simpson

*The story of house,

Far from Eltham in the cold winters of Canada .......... the story of one family in the 1900s

The continuing story of one family who left south east London for Canada in 1913, told by Carol Spencer.*

The family in 193 with two unknown chilldren
"The first summer was spent in a tent until they got a log home constructed.

This was a small home with a kitchen, living room and two tiny bedrooms on the end.  It was about 20 feet by 8 feet in size with a cellar underneath. The roof was covered with sod lifted from the ground near the house.

The logs were chinked with mud and straw to block the cold winds in winter.  Later the inside walls would be covered with first newspapers and brown paper whichever was available.

Eventually Maude was able to add wallpaper and decorate but that was far into the future.  A wood cook stove in the kitchen and a heater in the living room provided heat.  Apple boxes and any wooden crates were used for storage and shelving as they became available.

The cellar was a dugout hole which you entered by a trap door in the kitchen.  This was used to store the winter’s supply of vegetables and canned food Maude processed in the summer and fall.  The first year the garden was a disaster.

Edwin, one of his sons and an unknown girl
Not having ever gardened Maude chose the spot where they had removed the sod(top soil) to make the roof. It seemed wise as it save plowing up the grass.  Unfortunately all the nutrients plants need to grow are in the top soil. Her garden was extremely poor.

As well there were many berries growing wild around them some right at their door.  These berries were saskatoons and blueberries and very plentiful through July and August.  A bachelor came by and told them that the saskatoons were poisonous never let the boys eat them.

This incorrect information was most unfortunate as fresh fruit was hard to come by and these berries could easily have been canned and used all the next winter.  They were a great addition to their diet in following years.

Edwin would supplement their diet hunting rabbits, prairie chickens, ducks, geese and deer.  This supplied meat when they had no pigs or cattle to butcher.

Chickens were also raised to supply eggs as well.

Supplies such as tea, coffee, flour and sugar had to be purchased at the local store, Red Cross Store and Post Office.

It was about 5 miles away and when families were short of cash things could be purchased on credit.  Very few luxuries such as candy or bought bread were bought.

The first year was very hard and lonesome.  Maude thought there must be a bridge nearby as she could hear hooves pounding of a bridge quite often.

This sound turned out to be the sound of a prairie chicken flapping its wings in a mating ritual not a bridge at all.

They had to clear a certain number of acres of land and with all the stones and trees this was very hard work.

They managed to do this and Edwin used the stones to build fences, reminiscent of England’s, around his farmyard.

Things remained difficult over the years and many jobs were taken on to supplement their income.

Norman became a well-digger and dug many wells throughout the area.  He and his boys were also very musical and they played at any local dances often for $1 or nothing.

He also became a justice of the peace as many of the other homesteaders were unable to speak or read English.  He would help them with legal papers and letters.

Maude became a midwife in the area and delivered many of the babies as there was no doctor or hospital closer than 30 miles away.

She took on the job of caretaker at the school that was built and was proud of the desk she received as payment, a proper piece of furniture.

Maude and Edwin became good friends with their new neighbors a gentleman from Germany with a teenage daughter and son.  These people could not speak English and Maude taught Nanny English using the Sears mail order catalogue.  This family remained close friends over the years."

© Carol Spencer, 2013

Pictures; courtesy of Carol Spencer

*The Harland Family,

Next; a success in Canada, new farms and a growing family

Tuesday, 23 December 2014

Shopping for Christmas wih T.C. Whitaker on Beech Road

It is the shop of Thomas Charles Whittaker at the bottom of Beech Road where it curves round into the Green.

And for me the attractions are many.  First we have a date, secondly it is possible to identify three of the four people in the picture and lastly there is that wonderful detail of all that the shop had to offer.

The date is 1906 and judging by the adverts for “CHOICE NEW CURRANTS AND SULTANAS [for] XMAS”and the boxes of Mincemeat we must be in late November or December.*

Standing in front of the shop by the open door in Thomas who was 40 years old when the picture was taken and to his right is his son “Charlie” and away in the corner is Mr Fox who the caption tells us was about to become the manager of the Stanley Grove shop.

Now it says something about the concentration of people around the green that old Thomas Whittaker could feel it made business sense to open another shop just round the corner and off the green, and later had another store I am told on Ivy Green Road.

But the captions and the photograph do not quite fit.  If the date is indeed 1906 then the figure to the left of Thomas Whitaker cannot be his son Charlie who would have been just ten years old, and while the Fox family lived at 19 Stanley Grove there is no evidence that they were running a shop at any time between 1903 and 1911.

There was a grocery shop at number 2 but this was run by the Whitely family.  Interestingly enough it was still a shop as late as 1972 and today while it is a residential property it is possible to see its origins as a shop.

So all of this points to a later date perhaps closer to the Great War or perhaps after 1918which  would be more creditable given the appearance of Thomas and his son Charlie. So all that is needed is a trawl of the later street directories for Stanley Grove and the occupants of nu 2.

And I suspect that the Whittaker’s bought up the little grocery story sometime after 1911, by which time widow Whitely was 55.

Now I am in real danger of becoming boring and reducing the story to something like the medieval debate on how many angels could dance on a pin head.**

So instead I will return to those wonderful shop displays which have all the brash marketing of that famous slogan “pile them high and sell them cheap.”  The windows are covered with products and adverts for products, ranging from fruit to biscuits and those great sides of meat hanging in the open while beside them over the door is an assortment of brushes.

All of which might allow Thomas to claim that from his shop there was all that the discerning shopper might want.

And of course there are all the household names that are still familiar from OXO and Crawfords, to Bovril and Skipper Sardines.  I like even the carefully crafted descriptions either side of the family name announcing the shop as a place of “High class Provisions, Family Grocer and Italian Warehouseman”

It is not the only photograph in the collection and I must at a later date introduce another which will have been taken at the same time and shows Mr Rogers with the horse and cart.  But that as they say is for another time.

Picture; from the Lloyd collection.

* There will be those Christmas experts who will point out that the date must be earlier in the year for no one serious about Christmas cakes and puddings would leave it till November to make them.

**Which apparently is really a piece of propaganda put about during the Reformation to discredit Catholic theology.

The family from south east London who did good in Canada in the early 20th century

This is the last for a while of stories about Edwin and Maud Harland who left south east London for Canada in 1913.

The family in 1913
It was written by Carol Spencer who is a descendant of the couple.

"Edwin managed to prove up his homestead and was very proud when his two sons procured homesteads next to him as they came of age.

His farm never grew very much larger. He managed to have a small herd of 7-10 cattle of which he was extremely proud too.

They had to work off the farm during the First World War and moved down to Lashburn which was about 40 miles south of the homestead at Red Cross.

While there Edwin worked for local farmers and dug wells.

He also built them a small home in the village.  Maude worked at the hospital as a cook and the boys attended school.  About 1919 they moved back to the homestead.

Tired of the hard life on the farm and all the neighbors and family having moved away to better land and prospects near Frenchman Butte, Maude decided to leave and move to the village of Frenchman Butte.

The family today
Edwin could not leave his dream even though it did not have a good future and stayed on the homestead.

He remained there until about 1960 when he fell ill and was cared for by his eldest son Lloyd until his death in 1970.

Edwin is buried at the Fort Pitt Church, Fort Pitt, Saskatchewan only a few miles south of his
homestead in Red Cross.

His eldest son, Lloyd and his sons and grandsons have brought Edwin’s dream to fruition as they run a large successful cattle ranch at Fort Pitt to this day.

Edwin and Maude gave so much to all the family in offering them opportunities they may never have had had they not been brave enough to take a chance themselves in 1912."

*The Harland Family,

© Carol Spencer, 2013

Pictures; from the collection of Carol Spencer

Monday, 22 December 2014

On the trail of more closed public lavatories

Burton Road
I am not sure what has surprised me most about the clutch of stories on our closed public lavatories.

Firstly it is the sheer number of them that are still around but more sadly the fact that so many are closed.

Today along with another from Andy Robertson who was out on the top of Burton Road are two more from the camera of Slideshow John.

The first is from the Princess Road and Barlow Moor Road junction  and the second is on Hollyhedge Road in Benchill.

Princess Road
Leaving aside all the old ladies and penny jokes it remains an awful situation that cash strapped local authorities have had to close so many.

Pictures; Burton Road, 2014, from the collection of Andy Robertson, and Princess Road and  Hollyhedge Road 2014, courtesy of Slideshow John

Hollyhedge Road

The Harland family of Saskatchewan, and a search for two young people

Now I have come to know the Harland family.*

They left south east London for a new life in Canada in 1912 and were one of that country’s success stories.

The early years were hard and they began life in Canada in a tent but with hard work and I guess a bit of luck they succeeded in carving out a decent life for themselves on a number of different farms across the country.

The story was written by Carol Spencer who is one of their descendants and will be featured on the blog through June and July.

Along with the story Carol supplied me with a series of photographs and it is one of these that has drawn me in and led me off on a trail of investigation.

At first glance there is nothing unusual about the image.  Edwin and Maud are pictured with their two barefooted sons beside a log cabin sometime in 1913.

But it is the other two young people who interest me.  They are unknown and of course might just be friends or the children of neighbours.

But they could also be British Home Children employed on the farm.  Now I don’t usually do speculation but in this instance I am tempted to run with the idea.

The Harland farm near Frenchman Butte in northwest Saskatchewan was not a large one and “things remained difficult over the years and many jobs were taken on to supplement their income.  

Edwin became a well-digger and dug many wells throughout the area.”**

Even so  so I guess it is a possibility that they did from time to time take on labour and that the two staring out at us were also from Britain.

But I doubt we will ever know, my friend Jean has promised to ask Carol and it may just be that a document or letter referring to a British child might turn up.

And that of course raises an exciting avenue of research which might spin off into discovering who these two were or at least the names of children employed by the Harland’s.

That said I am at the limits of my knowledge and will have to explore the extent to which BHC were engaged in this part of Canada and who were the most likely charities to settle young people here in the first decade of the 20th century.

All of which may or may not help us with discovering the identities of the two young people, and with history being what it is it is just as likely that they were friends of the family in which case it has all been a bit of a wasted journey.

Well we shall see.

Pictures; courtesy of Carol Spencer

The Harland Family,

**Carol Spencer, Edwin Norman Harland 

Sunday, 21 December 2014

From south east London to Canada in 1913 part 2

This is the continuing story of Edwin and Maud Harland who left their home in south east London for Canada.*

Edwin as a young man
The story was written by Carol Spencer a direct descendant

"In the spring of 1913 Edwin set out to find his own piece of land.  They went on to Saskatoon and he made a couple of expeditions out to find the land of his dreams.

He travelled up to Carrot River area but was sure there were not enough trees.  (Carrot River is one of the richest farm areas in our province).  Next he checked out Red Cross District in Northwestern Saskatchewan.

Carrot River has rich, flat prairie land with lots of water.  Red Cross has many trees and rocky soil.  To Edwin the choice was clear!  Red Cross had trees for firewood and many rocks to build with.

Unfortunately rocks were not used much for building and trees needed to be removed before plowing.  His lack of farm experience left them in a difficult, tough life style.

The train line had reached Edam by this time and Edwin again loaded his family and belongings on the train and headed to northwest Saskatchewan to claim his homestead.

Maud with one of her sons to the right
Once in Edam a wagon and horses were purchased and all their belongings were loaded on to it and off to the claim they headed.  It was about a 60 mile journey and would take 2-3 days.

The road was a dirt trail of wagon ruts that required them to cross the Turtle River over which there was no bridge.

To Edwin it looked quite shallow and narrow.  He had Maude drive the wagon across then realized he was still on the wrong side of the river.  Being fairly athletic he decided he could very likely just jump the river and rejoin his family.

It was quite cool and the water was very cold as the ice had just thawed.  He backed up and took a running leap his long coat-tails flaring out behind.

Unfortunately he misjudged the distance and landed in the middle of the stream with the coat-tails floating out behind him.

Cold and wet he had to continue on as his family tried to hide their mirth!!  There were several stopping houses along the way for the family to stop at nights until they reached their claim."

Next; their first summer in Canada

© Carol Spencer, 2013

Pictures; courtesy of Carol Spencer

*The Harland Family,

Saturday, 20 December 2014

Snapshots of the Great War nu 3 ........... the Manchester Pals

Now I don’t have a date for the picture but it’s of a young James Callaghan of the 8th Battalion of the Manchester Regiment.

He was one of almost 10,000 men who enlisted in the eight Manchester Pals battalions which were formed in the first few months of the Great War.

The day after Lord Liverpool called for the formation of a Pal’s battalion in Liverpool, Manchester followed suit.

He had spoken of the need for "a battalion of pals, a battalion in which friends from the same office will fight shoulder to shoulder for the honour of Britain and the credit of Liverpool.“

In the early days the authorities couldn’t keep pace with the numbers wanting to join up.

Of the almost 10,000 who enlisted 4,776 were killed.

In recognition of the commitment and sacrifice made during the Great War the People’s History Museum has an exciting programme of events to accompany their changing exhibition A Land Fit for Heroes which runs till February 2015.*

Picture; James Callaghan, date unknown courtesy of Joe Callaghan and embroidered picture post card from the collection of David Harrop

*A Land Fit for Heroes,

Friday, 19 December 2014

Down in Darley Avenue ......... part 3

 Now one of Andy Robertson’s projects in recording changing Chorlton is Darley Avenue.

He began Taking picture of the site of the old school soon after the builders broke the ground for the new estate and he has been going back regularly.

So here is one of the next in the story.

The buildings are up awaiting and awaiting a roof and then once the places are weather proof the business of fitting them out can begin.

Pictures; from Andy Robertson’s series on Darley Avenue 2014

Thursday, 18 December 2014

Walking through Stalybridge with memories of 40 years ago part 2 ........ two pubs and a canal

They say you should never go back to a place that you left a long time go especially if it is somewhere with fond memories.

Now Stalybridge is one of those places.

When we lived on Raynham Street 40 years ago Stalybridge was where we went after a walk in Stamford Park.

After all it was just a short trip and rang the changes from Ashton market and the library.

Not that I can ever remember visiting any of the pubs and so Peter’s paintings are a nice reminder of what we may have missed.

At which point I usually go off on a bit of historical research, but today I shall just let the pictures capture a bit of Stalybridge and wish I had taken a few photographs of these places 40 years ago.

Of course I am sure there will be plenty of people with memories, stories and pictures of the two pubs along with the canal and perhaps in the fullness of time they might share them on the blog.

Which just leaves me to offer up one last confession which is that as far as I can remember I never managed to visit the canal.

And that was also my loss for nothing adds to a place than the presence of water, be it a river or a waterway.

Painting; The Q Inn, The Old Fleece Inn, Huddersfield Narrow Canal Stalybridge,  © 2014 Peter Topping, Paintings from Pictures

Wednesday, 17 December 2014

Wondering about ghost buildings and ghost signs down at the Rochdale Canal on Whitworth Street West

I like this picture of the Rochdale Canal with the Central Station and the Beetham Tower.

It was one of a series Andy Robertson took a few days ago and neatly captures the changing skyline and also reveals more if you look more closely.

The canal runs from Castlefield up to the Dale Street Basin and cuts through the city and after decades of neglect is back as a working waterway.

In the same way some of the old railway track which ran into Central is now part of the Metro link while the old station has become the modern exhibition centre.

But what draws me is in the line of that ghost building to the left of the huge window and the ho;es in the brickwork which would have been for floor joists.

In time I shall go looking for the evidence of that ghost building and perhaps also descipher the ghost sign below the parapet.

Of course there may well be someone who can supply the answers and maybe come up with more of the history of this spot which for those who don’t know is the corner of Whitworth Street West and Albion Street.

Pictures; from the collection of Andy Robertson, 2014

Tuesday, 16 December 2014

More on that hole in the ground in St Peter's Square

Now you can never get too much of a good story about a hole in the ground.

And so here is the third of the stories about the hole that has been opened up in St Peter’s Square.

It all started when Sally told me that excavations were under way in front of One St Peter’s Square which had once been the site of St Peter’s Church which had been demolished in 1907 after a century and a bit of serving the community.

She kindly took some pictures which revealed the remains of the church and Andy Robertson has sent me some of his to add to the collection.

Together they offer up some fascinating glimpses into the old church, for amongst the assorted service pipes and old Corporation tramlines can be seen the large stones which formed the base of the wall around the church.

They are revealed for the first time in Andy’s pictures for over a century and can be compared with the pictures of the church both during and before its demolition.

But the pictures also reveal how the old church dominated the surrounding buildings but would today be dwarfed by the modern properties which have gone up since 1907.

Sadly I know I will never be invited down to crawl over what is left of the archaeology of the church its crypt and its foundations so I will have to be content with the scene recorded by Andy and Sally.

Of course by the time it came down in 1907 much of the residential properties had themselves long gone replaced by offices and warehouses and so I guess the church was a little surplus to requirements.

I have to confess I think it is not the most attractive churches to have

graced the city and I can't say that tower or clock does much for me.

In time I think I will go and look for its history some of which is revealed in a wonderful guide book on Manchester in the 1850s but that is for another time.  Instead I will just close with this interior shot of the church taken as the workmen were beginning to know it down.

Pictures; St Peter’s Square in 2014 from the collection of Andy Robertson and, the church in the process of being demolished in 1907, m80961, as it was before demolition 80329, W H Fisher,  and the interior in 1907, m71326, courtesy of Manchester Libraries, Information and Archives, Manchester City Council,

Monday, 15 December 2014

Down at Plymouth Grove part two ............. looking for clues to its past

Now there are still trees along Plymouth Grove but I doubt that they have the same presence as those a century and a bit ago and even less than those back in 1844 when this was an elegant through fare of fine houses set in large landscaped gardens.

All that is left of those fine houses is number 84 Plymouth Grove once the home of Mrs Gaskell and which has recently been restored.

So it is hard to really get a sense of what it had been.

That said the clearances of the last half century put away much of the buildings which filled the open land around those big houses.

So that today the Plymouth Grove Hotel and the Methodist chapel on the corner of Hyde Place and Hyde Grove are about all you will get of what the area had been like in the 1890s as number 84 is of the 1840s.

But there are ways of finding out more.

The easy way of course is to look at the pictures in the digital archive* but for Andy Robertson the challenge was go out with his camera.

Now as then the Plymouth Grove Hotel dominates the corner and maybe soon will be restored to some of its former glory.

And then there is that Methodist Chapel which as Andy’s picture reveals has lost some of its imposing past.

The clue is in that line on the gable end that shows a ghost building.

This was the Sunday school and it was as big as the chapel itself.  Not that we should be surprised because great importance was placed on the role of the Sunday School and many were impressive buildings in their own right.

The Sunday school on Manchester Road in Chorlton is a big building and although it is no longer a school its size bears witness to the efforts the Methodists gave to sound religious education for the young.

Now I don’t know any more about it but I will in time go looking in the digital collection and I am confident there will be some records of the place.

For now it is just another confirmation that if you go looking you will find little bits of the past in the least promising of places.

Pictures; Plymouth Grove, 2014 from the collection of Andy Robertson 

* Manchester Libraries, Information and Archives, Manchester City Council,

Mr Knox and his 16 passengers in Orillia Ontario on a sunny day in 1911

Orchard Point, 1911 from the collection of Frank Kehoe
I am in Orchard Point, Ontario with a picture from 1911 which I grant is a long way from Chorlton, but images travel and this one in its way is a perfect piece of history.

It comes from a collection posted by the Orillia Museum of Art & History which I often visit because it “showcases the best of Orillia and Lake Country's culture and history through local and nationally significant exhibitions. OMAH's Discovery Gallery makes art touchable and fun for all ages”

And while I doubt I will ever be able to visit OMAH for those who might it “is located in the heart of Orillia's downtown shopping and restaurant district and is wheelchair accessible.”*

And so to the picture which I think works on many different levels for here is another of those images where lots of things are happening.

Mr Knox, and some of the children
At the centre is Mr Knox who we will return to later but for me it is the sixteen children who have crowded on to his car that draw you in to the photograph.

Some stare directly into the camera in the way that so many people did in those early picture from the beginning of the 20th century.

Others concentrate on the road ahead or the conversations of their friends.

But above all it is that sheer pleasure and novelty of a ride in a motor car and reminds me of that moment when Mr Shaw of Shaw’s Garages on Barlow Moor Road proudly stood in front of the first street side petrol pump in Chorlton.  As with this picture the camera had drawn a crowd but sadly unlike this one apart from Mr Shaw the rest of the people are lost to history.

Lillian Harris
But here sitting in Mr Knox’s car on that sunny day in 1911 are the names of all the children who climbed aboard and with those names a little of the story of the day.

The photograph is in the possession of Frank Kehoe who writes

“In 1911, sixteen children living at Orchard Point were given a real treat, a ride in a horseless carriage belonging to a Mr. Knox from Chicago. Mr. Knox had his car shipped from Chicago for his use when he spent his summers at the Klondike Hotel located at the Atherley Narrows. The hotel burnt in 1914. 

Back Row (L. to R.) Aubrey Gaudaur, Greta Harris, Mary Gaudaur, Stella Gaudaur, Rownea Gaudaur, Reg Gaudaur, Grace Stackhouse. Middle Row (L. to R.) Lillian Harris, Eva Harris, Nellie Harris. 

In front of Mr. Knox (the driver): Mavis Gaudaur, Stanley Harris, Oswald Harris, Selby Gaudaur, Mansel Harris. 

Still residing in Orillia are Reg Gaudaur’s children, Barbara McEown, Ross Gaudaur and Stella Gaudaur’s son, Frank Kehoe.”

So this makes Mr Kehoe’s picture such a treasure.  For those in Orillia the names of the children are a direct link to the towns’ past while for me the image captures the early age of the motor car, and perfectly captures that sunny day in 1911 when the car came to town.

Nellie Harris
Picture; from the collection of Frank Kehoe as displayed on the facebook site of the Orillia Museum of Art & History,

*Orillia Museum of Art & History, Peter Street South | Orillia, Ontario | L3V 5A9 | Telephone: (705) 326-2159

**Always check your photo collections,