The grim side to some of our Manchester pubs

Now I am back with Peterloo and the dastardly actions of the Manchester Yeomanry who on August 16th, 1819, charged a peaceful crowd in St Peter’s Fields, leaving many dead and wounded.

The Manchester Yeomanry in action, 1819

And over the last few days I have been exploring* the background of the 101 men listed in the Northern Star as participating in the outrage.**

We can track the occupations of 87 of them, and they represent a cross section of the population, with over a third drawn from the “people of plenty”, another 29% who made their living as publicans and shopkeepers, which left the rest as a mix of skilled, and manual workers, with the odd surprises which include a “Professor of Dance” and a quack doctor.

But today I am interested in the nine publicans.  They were William Bowker of the King's Head at 4 Old Shambles, John Beeston who ran the Windsor Castle in Salford, and later took over the George at 47 Deansgate, and William Benson of the Fox at 1 Jackson’s Row.

The Briton's Protection, 2016 as seen in the book

To these three we can add Mr. Burgess of the Hen & Chicken on 163 Deansgate, Parker Horsefield of the Briton’s Protection on Waterloo Street by Great Bridgewater Street, Edward Hall of the Blue Cap at 80 Greengate, Jacob Chadderton who offered up beer and cheer at the Wool Pack in Pendleton, John Reid of the Globe, Gartside Street and Samuel Lees of the Crown and Thistle, 9 Half Street, Manchester.

Of these I am pretty sure that only one of the nine pubs still in business is the Briton’s Protection, but some will have lasted longer than others.

So, while the Blue Cap on Greengate had vanished by 1850, the Windsor Castle on New Windsor in Salford was still there thirty-one years after Peterloo.

The Windsor Castle Salford, 1850

Had I come across this bit of information back in 2016, it might well have been included in our book on city centre Manchester Pubs, that said as the book is only about ones you can visit today that would have limited the inclusion of the Manchester Yeomanry landlords to just the Briton’s Protection.

That said, I see no reason why I shouldn’t pursue the remaining eight, starting with the Fox on the corner of Deansgate and Jackson’s Row which was still selling happiness or sadness in 1844, but now sits under Onward Building.

So in the fullness of time we  shall see just what can be found out about the two Salford pubs and their landlords, followed up by the more  Manchester landlords and their pubs.

The Fox, Jacksons Row, 1844

Location; Manchester and Salford

Pictures; "Manchester Heroes", Peterloo, print from etching by unknown artist, published by S W Fores, 1819, m07587, courtesy of Manchester Libraries, Information and Archives, Manchester City Council, http://images.manchester.gov.uk/index.php?session=pass, New Windsor, Salter’s Street Directory, 1850,  The Fox Inn, Jackson’s Row, 1844, from the OS for Manchester & Salford, 1844, courtesy of Digital Archives Association, http://digitalarchives.co.uk/


*The Manchester Yeomanry, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.com/2019/08/exploring-butchers-of-peterloo-101-men.html

**The Northern Star, Chartist newspaper, August 20th 1842

*** Manchester Pubs- The Stories Behind the Doors, Centre Centre along with  our two companion volumes,  Manchester Pubs- The Stories Behind the Doors, Chorlton-cum-Hardy, and  Manchester Pubs- The Stories Behind the Doors are available from www.pubbooks.co.uk and Chorlton Books

The lost pubs of Salford ............. 1872

Now one of the things that happen so often in researching old newspapers is you get side tracked.

And so yesterday while continuing to trawl the papers for references to Salford’s children’s charity I happened on this little piece of pub history.*

Now I could begin a search for each but that would draw me away from the work of uncovering the history of the Refuge for the new book, so I won’t.**

Instead I will leave it to others to rummage through their collection of pub books or better still come up with memories of some of those listed in the report.

Location; Salford, 1872





Picture; from the Manchester Weekly Times, January 13 1872


*The Manchester & Salford Boys’ and Girls’ Refuges, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Manchester%20and%20Salford%20Boys%20and%20Girls%20Refuges

**In the midst of plenty ........ two children sleeping rough “one under a Salford Railway arch and the other below an old staircase in a Deansgate entry” https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.co.uk/2017/07/in-midst-of-plenty-two-children.html

The listed pub….. a famous railway line .... and something I never knew about Patricroft

This is the Queen’s Arms in Patricroft, which is a pub I have never visited.

But I rather think I will given that after Andy took the picture he discovered a bit of it’s history , which he tells me, is that  “I sent you this pub a few days ago. I have since found out it is listed and was built in 1828 and altered in the early 20c.

It is known locally as the Top House and was formerly called Patricroft Tavern. It was purposely built as a refreshment stop for the Manchester and Liverpool Railway. It claims to be 'the world's first railway pub'”.

To which another source records that it was "built in 1828 in anticipation of the Liverpool-Manchester railway which opened in 1830, although the internal arrangements are probably late Victorian. 

Inside the front door is a small, cosy drinking lobby with a hatch-like screen to the serving area in the vault (a name appearing in the window glass).

 Here the counter seems to be Victorian although the bar-back is a replacement from 1997. Right of the entrance is the snug with draught screens and fixed seating. At the rear of the pub two rooms have been practically turned into one (done in 1996): note the ‘billiards’ and ‘bar parlour’ inscribed in the glass”.*

So one to visit I think, and in the meantime I shall trawl the old directories to find out more.

Location; Patricroft

Pictures; Queen’s Arms, 2020, from the collection of Andy Robertson

The Salford Four ……………….

I suppose if were being strictly accurate, the Four are really just 3½.

Andy captured all Four yesterday on a stroll down Bolton Road adding they are, “the Wagon & Horses, the ex Dog & Partridge, the Wellington, and the Red Lion.

Only a small road and another building separate three of the pubs.

The Wagon and the Wellington are 1970s pubs replacing older pubs of the same name. 

If you love Holts Bitter then this is not a bad place to live!”

Look carefully, and there are still signs of the Dog and Partridge’s of its former existence.

Location; Bolton Road

Pictures; The Salford Four, 2020, from the collection of Andy Robertson

A message to everyone at the Bulls Head Greengate, 1916 from MC

Now this picture of the Bulls Head will be familiar to many who have a fascination for Salford’s history.

But it has left me perplexed.  The message on the back is dated 1916 and signed M/C and just refers to the Old house at Salford but just to make it a little bit more confusing it had been written in French.

So are we dealing with a soldier away on the Western Front?  And could MC be related to J Charwood whose name also appears on the card.

The obvious starting point is the publican of the Bulls head.  In 1911 this was Thomas Dalton who had been pulling pints as far back as 1901 and maybe even earlier.

A decade earlier he was working the pub with his wife Sarah who at 57 was four years older than him, and they were assisted by their daughter Jane who was 30 years old.

But by 1911 Thomas had a new wife called Harriat who at 32 was thirty-three years is junior and Jane had left.

The key will of course be the directory for 1916 which will show whether Mr or Mrs Dalton were still living in this four roomed house at 47 Greengate.

There is a record of the death of a Thomas Dalton in 1914 which might be him and could explain how the landlord had become J Charwood.

That excellent guide to the history of pubs in Manchester & Salford tells me that it might date from 1590, was still offering up pints in the 1930 and was demolished in 1938.*

Not that I am any closer to finding M/C but maybe I am not too far away with the suggestion from garnet that M/C is just a reference to Manchester which is so obvious it had never occurred to me but never one to pass up advice or hide behind a mistake I am pleased with the correction.

Location; Greengate Salford

Picture; picture postcard of Ye Bulls Head, circa 1916 from the collection of David Harrop

*Pubs of Manchester, http://pubs-of-manchester.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/bulls-head-greengate.html

The New Oxford in Salford .............. a pub with more names than me

Now here is a pub with a history and I rather think a shed load of stories.

The New Oxford, 2015

After all according to that excellent pub site the Pubs of Manchester “the New Oxford was originally the Town Hall Tavern beer house in the 1850s in what was then Bexley Street, it become the Court Tavern a few years later then the Amateurs Arms in 1871 when it contained a music hall.”*

Later it changed its name again to the Oxford Hotel when Wilsons Brewery acquired it and the four neighbouring shops and cottages.

There is more but for that you will just have to follow the link and read the rest of the story.

The Town Hall and the pub that became The New Oxford, 1844 

I can’t say I have been inside but Peter’s painting has certainly made me want to.

And as we get to the midpoint on the book on Manchester pubs it may well be time to go down there and sample the beer just of course in the interests of historical research and to see how better Salford pull a pint.





Location; Bexley Square Salford

Paintings; the New Oxford, Salford, © 2015, Peter Topping,
Facebook; Paintings from Pictures, Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk


Map; Bexley Square, 1844, from Manchester & Salford OS, 1844, courtesy of Digital Archive Association, http://digitalarchives.co.uk/

*The New Oxford, Manchester Pubs, http://pubs-of-manchester.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/New%20Oxford%20-%20Bexley%20Square

Salford pubs ................. nu 1 ........ The King's Arms and a bit of a mystery

Now here is an old story with a  lesson in being overconfident and not looking for the simple answer.

This is the King’s Arms in Bloom Street, the sign on the side of the pub says 1883 and from another source I got the date 1879 for when it was built.

And I just wondered why in the middle of the reign of the old Queen our pub would be called the King’s Arms when you would expect it to be the Queen Victoria, especially given that the coat of arms at the top of the building is that of Queen Victoria.

Of course the solution was supplied by the pub’s own web site, “the original Kings Arms stood on a plot across Bloom Street from the present pub and was first licensed in 1807.

At this time Bloom Street was lined on both sides with houses, shops and beer houses.
In October 1850 The Kings Arms was advertised to let by the Adelphi Brewery.

The new tenant was Thomas Holden and when he was leaving in September 1858, the advertisement stated that the pub had been selling seven barrels of beer a week for seven and a half years.

The original premises pulled down to make way for the building of Salford Corporation's gas offices and the current building was constructed in the 1870s on the opposite side of the street.

For over a century the three main buildings on Bloom Street were the Corporation gas offices, Salford House and The Kings Arms. The gas offices closed long ago and the last residents of the hostel left in the 1990's but happily The Kings Arms is still in business.”

And there you have it and what’s more I suggest you check out that site because the King’s Arms has more to offer.

All of which just leaves me to confess that I had written about the pub back in 2014, but Peter’s fine painting made me decide it was time to revisit and remind him he owes me a pint which we could very well take in the King’s Arms.

Location; Salford

Painting; the Kings’s Arms, Salford, © 2016 Peter Topping, Paintings from Pictures,

Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

Facebook:  Paintings from Pictures

*The King’s Arms, http://www.kingsarmssalford.com/index.php?id=8

The Black Horse Salford ................... remembering better times

Now for anyone with fond memories of the Black Horse on the Crescent I think this is how they would want to remember it. 

The Black Horse in happier times

It was opened in 1875 and while I can’t be sure he was the first landlord Mr John Maycock was there pulling pints and offering advice in 1877 and was still there a full six years later.

And with a bit more digging I should be able to track him across the years and come up with the later publicans who ran the place.


It has fallen on hard times,  having closed around 2003 it has sat empty and forlorn ever since.

But it captured the attention of Peter Topping who set out to paint the pub in its last throws of glory.

Empty and forlorn

And not content with that he began some painstaking research looking at older images peeling back years of old paint and additions to the building.

One photograph from the 1970s clearly shows there was once an entrance on the left of the door which might have given access for the brewery’s waggons.

Another reveals that the sign above the door has had at least one major paint job which might have been the moment the pub changed its name to the Black Horse Hotel from the Black Horse Inn.

Now this I know because picked out in ceramics directly over the door is the title the Black Horse Inn, which no one bothered to hide when the painted sign was added.

When that happened is unclear.  The directories in the 1870s and 1880s just list the pub as at the Black Horse.

But I bet there will be someone who remembers and will offer up this bit of information.

Remembering it as it was

Others have already supplied me with pictures of the carved keystones above the ground floor which range from a horse head and a set of blacksmith tools to a satyr and Bacchus.

All of which must once have looked very impressive but as Andy Robertson’s picture from last year shows they and the rest of the place are in a sorry state.

So like many I will just go back to Peter’s painting and reflect on its past grandeur.

Picture; The Black Horse, 2014, from the collection of Andy Robertson, 

Painting; Back Horse, Salford © 2016 Peter Topping 

Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

Facebook: Paintings from Pictures https://www.facebook.com/paintingsfrompictures

On Chapel Street with a pub question ................ another Salford pub story

Now I don’t do pub quizzes.

The Rovers Return, 2014

I get stumped at even the easiest of challenges like “what connects Chapel Street in Salford, with an English Admiral and a long running and much loved soap?"

The answer of course is the Rovers Return on Chapel Street, once known as the Lord Nelson and now named after that famous pub in Coronation Street.

And that is my point.

Unless you know the pub, or have an intimate knowledge of  all the drinking places in Salford combined with a love of that said soap, it’s a question best left to others.

Chapel Street in 1849

But once started I was off to dig deeper into the story behind the pub that Peter painted back in 2014.

It was offering up pints under its name of the Lord Nelson as early as 1824 and in time I will discover when it first opened and track something of the lives of those who ran it.

By the 1860s this was Mr James Mitchell and he was competing with twenty-nine other pubs and beer shops stretching from the start of Chapel Street at Greengate to the Whitecross bank.*

For those who want to give that figure some perspective, there were 131 properties on the same side as The Lord Nelson of which fourteen were drinking establishments while facing our pub there were another fifteen out of 111 buildings.

A bit more of Chapel Street again, 1849

And for anyone with a keen interest in pub names, Chapel Street in 1863 offered the lot, from those which fell back on animals to  a few wanting to cash in on royalty and  the odd one with a link to the industries of Salford.

As for the Lord Nelson our naval hero gave way to the Rover’s Return it is said in deference to that pub on that famous street.

And someone out three will have the date for that, which I suspect would flummox the quiz organiser.

And just after I posted the story P J Thompson who regularly  contributes to the blog added that "1988 was the name change year for the Lord Nelson. It was a Wilsons house, I liked the mild back then."  Thanks P J.

Location; Salford

Painting; the Rovers Return, Salford © 2014 Peter Topping 

Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

Facebook: Paintings from Pictures https://www.facebook.com/paintingsfrompictures

Map; Chapel Street, 1949 from the OS Manchester & Salford, 1849, courtesy of Digital Archives Association, http://digitalarchives.co.uk/

Where we began on Chapel Street in 2014

*1. The Red Lion,37. a beer shop, 47. The Printer’s Arms, 59. The Black Lion, 73. The Punch Bowl, 83, The Lord Nelson, 89. The Barley Sheaf, 125. The Wheatsheaf, 139. The Old Queen Ann, 153, The Dyer’s Arms, 159, Albert Vaults, 177.The Brown Bull, 195. The Griffin, 221. a beer shop, 223. The Red Lion

**2. The Canterbury Hall, 14. The Spread Eagle, 22. The Old King’s Head, 32. The Dog and Partridge, 38.the Rose & Crown, 66 The Unicorn, 76. The Royal Archer, 78. A beer shop, 88. The Dog, 94. The Custom House, 100. The Queen’s Arms, 110. The Moulder’s Arms, 116 The Coach & Horses, 138. The New Market, 142, The Salford Arms

Salford’s Pubs ............. a priceless collection of drinking places

This is a book I forgot I had.

It was written by Tony Flynn and Alan Gall and published by Neil Richardson, price £1.50

The discovery was the prize for having to tidy and clear the cellar.

Now there are two ways of approaching the task, which is either to be reconciled to a long and dirty day away from the computer and shed loads of research or look upon it as an opportunity to find treasures long since lost and forgotten.

And as I came across quite a few books which had long ago gone to the cellar the rewards were all there.

More so because I had recently tried to get a copy only to find that even on Amazon it was a book too far.

All of which has meant that I have relied on my friend Alan who has been kind enough to offer up information on some of the pubs I stumbled across on Greengate and at times correcting me when I got things wrong.

Not that my use of my copy will spoil our friendship but I suspect will have added to it.

And that is all I want to say other than we all owe Mr and Mrs Richardson a debt for the way they have supported local historians who wanted to tell the story of their home town.

At a time when few of the big publishers were touching local history Neil Richardson was publishing books on everything from Salford and Manchester pubs to memories of growing up in Cheetham Hill and serving in local Pals Battalions.

Location; Salford

Pictures; cover front and reverse Salford’s Pubs, Tony Flynn and Alan Gall and published by Neil Richardson

Salford Pubs ............. the Packet House Barton Road

Now here is a pub with a history.

It’s just I haven’t got round to looking it up.

Packet Boats ran regular services along our canals.  They offered up to two rates for the wealthy and the middling customers and some had huge panoramic windows and were even pulled by horses with riders in livery.

The Packet House is not one I know so its a thank you to Andy and also to Bill who points out that its "a good old Eccles Barton on Irwell Eccles Pub, not in Salford really but for boundary changes. Always well kept and popular locally but I bet not many know the significance of the name."

And P.J. Thompson who had already corrected me quite rightly with "it's not really a Salford pub, Eccles had nothing to do with Salford before 1974 and had its own council, town hall and mayor."

Now this is what I like.

Location, Salford

Pictures; the Packet House, 2016 courtesy of Andy Robertson

Looking for a story in the Eagle Inn on Collier Street ................. another Salford pub

Now Collier Street is one of those typical inner city streets.

The Eagle Inn, 2011

It is narrow, doesn’t really seem to lead anywhere, and apart from the Eagle Inn and some undistinguished retail units there isn’t much there.

The last time I visited the place the old Greengate Baths were looking even more forlorn and derelict.

The baths had opened in the August of 1856, closed just twenty four years later and then for a century it did the business as a warehouse.

But since 1990 the building has been doing nothing save slowly deteriorating year by year.

All of which is a contrast to what Collier Street had once been.  By the 1840s the east side consisted of a row of terraced houses running up from Queen Street to Greengate, while part of the opposite side was a mix of houses with tiny courts behind leaving the rest of that side dominated by part of the Salford Union Workhouse.

The street directories of the time wrote the place off, listing just a few of the residents.

Collier Street, 1849

The British Rolla public house did get a mention.  It stood on the corner of Collier and Rolla Street.

It was still there a full half century later although by then the baths, the Roman Catholic school and St Peter’s Church had replaced the workhouse.

But sometime between 1894 and 1895 it shut up shop or at least falls out of favour with the street directories and is no longer listed.  That said nature abhors a vacuum and across the road at number 19 Collier Street a Mr John Stone is brewing and selling his beer.

And that nicely brings me back to the Eagle, which some sources suggest was open for business by 1902.

Of course to check that out will involve a trawl of the licensing records.

So for now I will content myself with saying that Mr Stone was there at 19 Collier Street from at least 1891 and was still there pulling pints with his wife Selina two decades later.  By then they had been married for 29 years and had nine children who ranged in age from 28 down to eight, all living in a property consisting of just five rooms.

I wonder how his trade fared.  The majority of those in Collier Street were labourers, with a washerwoman, cleaner and shoe maker and some were bringing up families in just one room.

But that as they say is another story.

What would be nice would be to track down Mr and Mrs Stone's family and show them Peter's fine painting of their old pub.

Location; Salford

Painting; the Eagle Inn, Salford © 2011 Peter Topping 

Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

Facebook: Paintings from Pictures https://www.facebook.com/paintingsfrompictures

Map; Collier Street, 1949 from the OS Manchester & Salford, 1849, courtesy of Digital Archives Association, http://digitalarchives.co.uk/

Salford Pubs ....... the Bulls Head

Now I am always prepared to revisit an old pub even one that I was with yesterday.

And in this case its the Bulls Head which I wrote about recently.

Nor am I alone in rehashing pictures of old pubs because the picture postcard companies were doing it all the time in the late 19th and early 20th centuries.

Often it just extended to reprinting, but sometime they colourised the old image and always one for an opportunity would on occasion over print the card with the message "Merry Christmas".

All of which was fine but in the case of the festive message this sometimes was superimposed on what was clearly a picture taken in high summer.

No matter as my friend Rodney would say if it sells that's the business.

And from Alan Jennings a poscript, " pub with a fascinating history, the cruck end of the pub dates from the 14th century andthe main front of it dates from between 1590 and 1630. the Bulls Head closed in 1930 and the Brewers Groves & Whitnall suggested that the building would make an interesting folk museum, 

They offered it to the Corporation and said it would not cost much to run and some old pensioner could be found to look after it, the Corporation declined saying the initial repair bill of £1,500 pounds and estimated running cost of £300 per annum could not be justified, in 1937 there was a fire and in 1938 the Bulls Head was demolished."

Location; Salford

Additional research Alan Jennings

Picture; the Bulls Hrad, Greengate, date unknown, from the collection of Mrs Bishop

The Duke of York on Marlborough Road ............ a pub with a history yet to be revealed

Now given its distinctive appearance you would think there would be more stories about the Duke of York on Marlborough Road.

After all Peter’s painting captures the place at its best but unless I have missed something there is little on the pub.

True there is a reference on the Joseph Holt site but as the Duke of York is a Holt’s pub that is only to be expected.

But it is confined to the simple "a beautiful Victorian Gothic building is within close proximity to Salford, Cheetham Hill and Broughton.

The Duke of York offers a traditional pub experience with darts, pool and live music nights at the weekends. 
The friendly pub also caters for the local community and newcomers are always welcome.”*

Nor does it appear on the Salford City Council page of local pubs or other sites which list pubs in the area.

Perhaps that’s because it still exists and is a bit off the usual Salford tourist haunts.

I am not yet sure when it was built but it will be after 1894 because the OS map for that year shows this stretch of Marlborough Road as undeveloped and the following year the directories still show it as unoccupied.

But just nine years later Mr Joseph Lord is pulling pints and dispensing Salford gossip.

So that pins down the date to a pretty narrow window and I am guessing the Holt’s brewery will know, so that will be my next port of call. Of course in the meantime someone may know and if they do I would welcome the information.

For one fleeting moment there was the possibility of a ghost story but that turned out to be another Duke of York in Eccles, and while there is an interior shot from the Getty Library dated 1926 it is unclear which of our two Salford pubs it is.

So that is it really.

Location; Salford

Paintings; the Duke of York, Marlborough Road, © 2015, Peter Topping,
Facebook; Paintings from Pictures, Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

*Joseph Holt,  http://www.joseph-holt.com/pubs/view/duke-of-york

The Kings Arms in Bloom Street

Now here is a lesson in being overconfident and not looking for the simple answer.

This is the King’s Head in Bloom Street, the sign on the side of the pub says 1883 and from another source I got the date 1879 for when it was built.

And I just wondered why in the middle of the reign of the old Queen our pub would be called the King’s Arms when you would expect it to be the Queen Victoria, especially given that the coat of arms at the top of the building is that of Queen Victoria.

Of course the solution was supplied by the pub’s own web site, “the original Kings Arms stood on a plot across Bloom Street from the present pub and was first licensed in 1807. 

At this time Bloom Street was lined on both sides with houses, shops and beerhouses.
In October 1850 The Kings Arms was advertised to let by the Adelphi Brewery. 

The new tenant was Thomas Holden and when he was leaving in September 1858, the advertisement stated that the pub had been selling seven barrels of beer a week for seven and a half years.

The original premises pulled down to make way for the building of Salford Corporation's gas offices and the current building was constructed in the 1870s on the opposite side of the street.

For over a century the three main buildings on Bloom Street were the Corporation gas offices, Salford House and The Kings Arms. The gas offices closed long ago and the last residents of the hostel left in the 1990's but happily The Kings Arms is still in business.”

And there you have it and what’s more I suggest you check out that site because the King’s Arms has more to offer.

All of which leaves me to thank Andy Robertson who took the pictures and alerted me to another Salford pub I have yet to visit.

Pictures; from the collection of Andy Robertson

*The King’s Arms, http://www.kingsarmssalford.com/index.php?id=8

Lost Salford Pubs ............. nu 1 the Red Lion

Now Salford like most places ins littered with lost pubs.

Many have been closed for a decade or more and sit empty and forlorn while a few are only marked by a hole in the or a brand new block of flats, leaving just a few memories of happy times before last orders were called.

And that brings me to the Red Lion which Andy says closed about 2006 and thinks was offering up pints by 1845 and was originally called the Egerton Arms.

One of us I know will go off looking for the historical detail and may confirm Andy’s other thoughts that it was briefly used as a place for growing things.

We shall see.

Location, Salford


Pictures; the Red Lion, 2016 courtesy of Andy Robertson

Stories of the Crescent in Salford yet to be told

Now I bet there will be plenty of stories about the Crescent.

Not that Mr Frederick Engels or Mr Marx will be calling me with their tales of boozy nights over the thorny bits of “Dialetical Materialism”*

Nor I suspect will it be the man who lost his stage coach ticket after a heavy night at the place and could only remember that he thought he might have been drinking in the Red Dragon.

And that rather sets the scene.

The popular story has Mr Marx and Engels in there swapping pints with discussions on how history worked and the future and that the pub was once the Red Dragon.

All of these and more stories can be found in that excellent site, Manchester Pubs and never one to steal another’s research I will just direct you to the link.**

All I will say is that I did a quick trawl of the directories and could find no Red Dragon,.

That said I only went back to 1850 when the Crescent was run by Hannah Bradburn and interestingly it doesn’t show up in later lists

So instead that just leaves me to comment on Peter’s painting which I like, and make that usual appeal for any stories or pictures, particularly ones from inside which rarely ever survive, if they were ever taken.

Painting; the Crescent, Salford © 2015 Peter Topping 

Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

Facebook: Paintings from Pictures https://www.facebook.com/paintingsfrompictures

*That political and historical events result from the conflict of social forces and are interpretable as a series of contradictions and their solutions and expressed succinctly as  “The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles." The Communist Manifesto, Chapter 1 Bourgeois and Proletarians, 1848

**Pubs of Manchester Past & Present, http://pubs-of-manchester.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Crescent%20-%20The%20Crescent

Stepping back in time ........... the Black Friar, Salford as it would look

Now I never visited the Black Friar on Blackfriars Road and Trinty Way but there will be plenty of people who did.

At which point if you are one of those people  you may want  to“turn away” because it hasn’t fared well over the years and on my last trip down Blackfriars Road, the pub  looked very sad and grim and I couldn’t bring myself to post a photograph of the place.

So for all those with happier memories of the pub here is a painting by Peter Topping of the Blackfriar at a moment in time before now.

He tells me that “after passing the pub on Sunday and seeing it slowly falling into dereliction I found an old Black & White picture which gave a good indication to what the windows looked like... So I have painted it as it would have looked today if it wasn't boarded up.”

And that is that, other than to say, following the successful publication of Manchester Pubs -The Stories Behind the Doors - City Centre at Christmas, Peter and I are now working on the pubs and bars of Chorlton-cum-Hardy, with a view of following it up with those of Salford

Location; Salford

Painting; Black Friar, as it would look. Painting © 2017 Peter Topping, Paintings from Pictures.
Web: www.paintingsfrompictures.co.uk

*A new book on Manchester Pubs https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/A%20new%20book%20on%20Manchester%20Pubs

Manchester Pubs is available fromwww.pubbooks.co.uk  or Chorlton Bookshop

Salford I am discovering for the first time part 2, Ye Old Nelson

Another from the archive.

Now it isn’t so much that I haven’t discovered the places in this series, just that I have passed them by without much of a second glance.

So here over the next few weeks are a selection of pictures from Andy Robertson who was out and  snapping buildings he likes and ones that I am being drawn to.

This is Ye Old Nelson whose story I will look up in the fullness of time, and perhaps sooner rather than later.

And yet again that appeal for anyone who has stories or pictures of the place in happier times would welcome for the blog.







Pictures; Ye Old Nelson, from the collection of Andy Robertson, 2014

The Salford I am discovering for the first time part 1, the Black Horse

From the archive one from 2014.

Now it isn’t so much that I haven’t discovered the places in this series, just that I have passed them by without much of a second glance.

So here over the next few weeks are a repeat of selection of pictures from Andy Robertson who was out and  snapping buildings he likes and ones that I am being drawn to.

This is the Black Horse Hotel whose story I will look up in the fullness of time, and perhaps sooner rather than later.

I can't think it is long for this world.

But then I haven't looked up the planning applications and there may be a scheme to save it and bring it back into use.

I hope so and in the meantime I shall just leave you with that repeated request if any remembers drinking there has stories of the place or even pictures I would like to use them in the blog.






Pictures; The Black Horse Hotel, 2014, from the collection of Any Robertson