When you can no longer spend a penny …….

Now I understand why over the last two decades, public lavatories have vanished from our streets and squares.

2014

Faced with enormous pressures to save money in the face of revenue cuts from central government, many local authorities have closed their public conveniences and redirected the money to front line services.

This I know, but as someone who longer ago parted company with a strong bladder it makes for uncomfortable problems. 

Seven years ago, Andy Robertson chronicled the closure of some of these vital bits of street furniture, and last week he was back with the one on Withington Road, opposite the former Whalley Hotel.

It was not the most attractive of buildings, but it did the biz.  

2021

For a while it was an office/show room, and now is Divine Wellness, serving vegetarian and vegan food, with heaps of good reviews.  You can dine in or drive by to pick up and has its own Facebook page.

So to mangle that biblical quotation from Judges that “out of the strong came something sweet” you could say out of a basic necessary has come something exciting. *

And there will be some who remember when the site, stretching from the corner of Moss Lane West along Withington Road was a strip of shops and houses.

1960

I don’t, but I do remember drinking in the Whalley Hotel and visiting a fine example of a Victorian urinal, which is but maybe now was in Birmingham.

Leaving me just to finish with that old and well-known piece of lavatorial graffiti, “Here I sit broken hearted, spent a penny and only farted”, for no other reason than for sixty years it has brought a smile to my face.

Only surpassed by "you have to kiss a lot of toads till you meet your Prince Charming" and often written on the bottom of the inside door, "beware limbo dancers"

1983

Pictures;  the change of use, 2014, & 2021, from the collection of Andy Robertson, and The Whalley Hotel, Whalley Range, Upper Chorlton Road, 1960, A.H.Downes, m40816,courtesy of Manchester Libraries, Information and Archives, Manchester City Council, http://images.manchester.gov.uk/index.php?session=pass and a Birmingham urinal, 1983 from the collection of Andrew Simpson

*Public lavatories of Manchester and Salford, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.com/search/label/Public%20lavatories%20of%20Manchester%20and%20Salford

**Judges 14:14

Down in Didsbury and away in Birmingham with the humble public lavatory

Now it has been some time since I pondered on the lost public lavatories of Britain.

Birmingham, 1983

And I can see that for some the subject lacks the romanticism of a ruined castle or the significance of listed great country house.

But they are in the way as equally important.

Some like the Victorian and Edwardian ones are unique pieces of work, with the outside care to detail matched by the interior tiles, and porcelain fittings.

Even those built in the last decade, while they can’t match the style of the earlier ones, say something about public architecture in post war Britain.

Added to which there is that simple observation that they reflect that commitment to municipal public health, and certainly for the Victorians came with a belief that even the humblest of structures should be imbued with good taste and be built to last.

Didsbury, 2019

So here are two of my favourites.

I have no idea if the iron one I photographed in 1983 still stands but the Didsbury one on Barlow Moor Road is still there, although it closed a long time ago.

Location; Birmingham and Didsbury

Pictures; 19th century public library, Birmingham, from the collection of Andrew Simpson, and 20th century, version Didsbury, 2019, courtesy of Andy Robertson

Another one of the lost public lavatories

Now it was Andy Robertsons who suggested the idea of a bog for the blog and contributed two fine late 20th century public lavatories.

Since then quite a few other people have chipped in with ones that I had entirely forgotten.

The upshot I reckon will keep him busy for a while.

In the meantime here is one suggested by Steven Robertson.  Steven offered up a few but this one I recall vividly.

Like so many it was situated near a pub, in this case the Lloyds in Chorlton and stood in the car park.

Now not so long ago I went looking into the history of the place and I think this bit of open land was where one enterprising landlady opened up a set of tennis courts in the 1880s.

Long gone now, along with the public lavatory and the car park.









Picture; The Lloyd Hotel with that public lavatory, 1970, A Dawson, courtesy of Manchester Libraries, Information and Archives, Manchester City Council, http://images.manchester.gov.uk/index.php?session=pass

The lost lavatories …………… Manchester and beyond

Today I was reminded of a short but sad series on the blog reflecting on the demise of our Corporation public lavatories.*

Albert Square, 1985

And yes, there is always a place for such a subject, especially if like me you suffer from “weak bladder blues”

This story was occasioned by a picture of Albert Square from 1967, which prompted Margaret to comment on the following lost lavatories,

1. Albert Square, 4 of them, external removed, steel plate laid, and all subterranean parts remain, was done in 1986
2. Great Bridgewater Street, all external remain and subterranean turned into a bar
3. Cathedral Approach/Victoria Street, all external removed and steel plate placed over entrance, all subterranean remain known as Cathedral Vaults.
4. Stevenson Square, most of external remain and bricked up (now turned into art project) presume subterranean still remains.
5. St Anne's Square, external still remains, subterranean now an electricity substation.

Birmingham, 1983

So, thank you Margret, and I expect this will not be we shall hear of those lost lavatories.

Location; Manchester and Birmingham

Pictures; Albert Square, detail from a picture by M. Luft, 1985, m00128, courtesy of Manchester Libraries, Information and Archives, Manchester City Council, http://images.manchester.gov.uk/index.php?session=pass   and Birmingham, 1983, from the collection of Andrew Simpson

*Public lavatories, https://chorltonhistory.blogspot.com/search?q=public+lavatories

**Margret Copeland Gain

On the trail of more closed public lavatories

Burton Road

I am not sure what has surprised me most about the clutch of stories on our closed public lavatories.

Firstly it is the sheer number of them that are still around but more sadly the fact that so many are closed.

Today along with another from Andy Robertson who was out on the top of Burton Road are two more from the camera of Slideshow John.

The first is from the Princess Road and Barlow Moor Road junction  and the second is on Hollyhedge Road in Benchill.

Princess Road

Leaving aside all the old ladies and penny jokes it remains an awful situation that cash strapped local authorities have had to close so many.


Pictures; Burton Road, 2014, from the collection of Andy Robertson, and Princess Road and  Hollyhedge Road 2014, courtesy of Slideshow John

Hollyhedge Road

At Stretford with Andy Robertson and a little bit more of our lost public history

So even the ugliest looking of public lavatories will fall victim to economies.

I have to confess I never even knew these ones existed but as part of his continued plan to capture our closed conveniences Andy Robertson snapped them earlier this week adding  “these were the public loos for Stretford Arndale or the ex public loos for Stretford Mall.

They have been closed for at least 10 years possibly even 20 and replaced by ones inside the building. The old ones were the best because they were free, now costs 48 old pennies!”

And with that nostalgic comment Andy moved off looking for more which will appear in the fullness of time.

Now there is of course a series point to the exercise, for not only are they a little bit of our history but also they are a public piece of history, opened in more optimistic times and in the case of the Victorian and Edwardian predecessors provided as part of that civic provision.

Picture; courtesy of Andy Robertson, 2014

Another two buildings closed and empty in south Manchester

Now compared to those impressive Victorian and Edwardian public lavatories these two are ugly buildings which even function cannot bestow any beauty on.

Withington Road and Moss Lane East, 2014

But like so many of those early public lavatories these have long been closed and I doubt will ever be reopened.

Indeed I remember a for sale sign gracing the side of the one on Withington Road and Moss Lane East.

I thought at the time and still do that this was an act of staggering optimism rather than a practical assessment of the property market.

Barlow Moor Road, 2014

Likewise the second at the top of Barlow Moor Road must be almost unique in that as Andy Robertson asks out it is “is there a facility like this anywhere that is  closer to two pubs, probably a combined distance of 40 yards?”

All of which is part of a new series which Andy has called a “bog for a blog” and which promises over the next few months to record many more of our closed and increasingly threatened public lavatories.

Pictures; Withington Road and Moss Lane East and the  top of Barlow Moor Road, 2014

Recording the passing of our great public lavatories .......... nu 1 down by Southern Cemetery

Now I doubt I am alone in mourning the loss of so many of our Victorian and Edwardian public lavatories.

They ranged from the sumptuous ones all glazed tile, shiny brass and rich dark wood, to the simpler public urinals and in their way they were as much a statement of municipal provision as the parks, the schools, the supply of gas and clean water and of course the tram and bus.

And most have gone, some rationalized out of the equation by bigger more modern conveniences and others just because they cost too much.

I still remember those in Albert Square and that one at the top of Great Bridgewater Street which became a pub.

All of which is a way of starting a new series from the camera of Andy Robertson who suggested that it was time for a “bog for the blog.”

He chose that one on Barlow Moor Road by Southern Cemetery to accompany the idea, and I rather think he has now walked his way into recording as many as he can because they are like the public water fountains and stone horse troughs vanishing from our streets and parks.

The horse troughs were the first to begin disappearing and while I can remember plenty when I was young I have to think hard about when I last passed one.

And if I were to ask my sons who are all now grown up I expect none of them will even know what I am talking about.

As for the public lavatories by the cemetery I doubt that they have even clocked they were there.

I know their closure passed me by.  But as you do I went looking for their history and the best I could come up with was that they were built sometime between 1894 and 1934.

Not much I grant you but there it is.

All of which just leaves Andy to go off and find some more with perhaps help from others.

Pictures; of the former public lavatories at Southern Cemetery, 2014, from the collection of Andy Robertson